[Fully Managed] Jay Smith from Root of PI Ep. 119

Introduction

Shannon Donnelly (SD): Alrighty. Hello, everyone, and welcome to the Fully Managed Podcast, the podcast where we discuss marketing and business tips to help assist you on your business journey. I’m your host, Shannon, Penji’s Partnership Coordinator, and I’m joined here today with Jay Smith from Rootify. Thank you so much for coming on with me today.

Jay Smith (JS): Thanks for having me. I appreciate that.

Jay’s Journey Into Automation

SD: Would you please start by telling us a little bit about yourself, how you’ve kind of worked your way up in your career at this point, and everything in between, anything that you think is relevant and important and fun?

JS: Gosh. Or not fun. So, yeah, it’s a long, strange trip. That’s fine. I grew up in California, and I’m One today, actually.

SD: Congratulations. Happy birthday.

JS: I was fortunate enough to live in California as a child. So we had computers in our classroom in third grade, even though I’m that old. So I’m a digital native, even though I’m far older than most people who are. After I left the Army in transportation logistics, I was always the computer guy. I introduced everyone in the office to Google. I’m like, you got to check this out. Sounds like I’m from the past, like, “Let me tell you about…”

SD: Pioneer of Google, right?

JS: Yeah, over the course of an operations career in logistics and manufacturing, I was always looking for ways to optimize processes. Every day, it’s a thousand fires. You never have enough staff or time, so I always asked, how can we automate this stuff? That’s always been my passion. After I left trucking several years ago, I wanted a change. I went into cybersecurity for a couple years as a private investigator, doing digital forensics. The pandemic kind of wiped that out, so I moved into building websites and doing digital marketing for business contacts. About two years ago, I pivoted us directly into automation and AI because of my background. It’s what I’ve always really wanted to do instead of just websites and SEO.

Focus on Nonprofits

JS: With ChatGPT hitting the scene, everyone now has a deeper understanding of AI. Automation has kind of ridden that coattail. It’s way more accessible for smaller organizations. I focus on nonprofits because I’ve done this for large organizations. There, the role is to get more value for shareholders. That usually means losing staff when automating. Nonprofits don’t see it that way. They say, “Great, we can refocus on our mission, we can upskill our staff.” These people work for you because they care about your cause.

SD: Honestly, I’m not even mad. That was very short and concise, and I appreciate that. Especially because I know that in other sectors it might just be seen as replacing jobs. But in nonprofits, they move people around because one person wears too many hats. They don’t have time for important things. So that’s a lovely tool to have.

JS: Yeah, it’s the shiny toy on YouTube. So, of course, people pick niches they think will bring them the most revenue.

SD: And nonprofits is never that.

JS: I focus on any company trying to make a positive impact. With the rise of AI, it’s important to help people refocus on what they’re passionate about. Let a robot handle accounts payable or onboarding. Focus on growing the nonprofit.

Defining Purpose-Driven Businesses

SD: I was going to ask what you meant by purpose-driven businesses, but I think you just answered that.

JS: Yeah, outside of nonprofits, they can make revenue too. Patagonia is a great example—very intentional about environmental and social impact. In Kentucky, we have something called the Canopy certification. Some may have heard of B Corps. Same concept—profit business behaving like a nonprofit. We’re about to have our fourth Good Business Summit. Chef Edward Lee and the CEO of Maker’s Mark are keynotes. So yes, I market myself to nonprofits, but I’ll do this for anybody.

JS: The way I communicate and gather data from users, if I walk into a business saying we won’t lay anyone off—and then you do—it ruins everything. So I’ll work with for-profits, but it must be clear. The most important part is discovery: figuring out what to automate. You can only do that with engagement from all levels.

SD: Yeah, a lot of businesses might think, “This is a way to save money.” And sure, it is—but if that just means firing people, that sucks.

JS: And I don’t want to generalize for-profits. I worked in them for 25 years. But in capitalism, that’s the CEO’s job—cut costs, raise revenue. Labor is usually the first target.

SD: Even the insurance is expensive. Less employees, less cost.

JS: Exactly.

Why Automation Helps Nonprofits More

SD: That’s why your services are important for nonprofits. Most of the time, they don’t want to cut staff. They just want to do things in a more mission-aligned way.

JS: What people may not realize is nonprofits don’t usually get funding for overhead like staff. But they do for R&D or special projects. If you can automate and upskill staff, you can handle attrition. Instead of hiring more admins, hire two rockstar fundraisers.

SD: That’s really interesting. Do you also consult on how to organize staff?

JS: In general senses, yes, but I try not to step on toes. They know their org best. But part of my process is experiencing their system like a constituent. I’ll go through web forms, onboarding—learn everything. I’ll share best practices from other orgs but try to let them drive.

SD: That makes sense. Thanks for clarifying.

Root of Pie: What’s in a Name?

SD: Switching gears. I read on your website—you call your agency “Root of Pie.” How did you come up with that?

JS: I read a lot—philosophy, nonfiction, stoicism. I have a psychology degree. Somewhere along the way, I heard a professor talk about the square root of Pi. It’s unique—it has boundaries between 1.0 and 2.0, but it’s infinite within. Our brains aren’t wired to understand infinity or nothingness. But the idea is within legal or governance boundaries, we can do anything with the right mindset.

SD: That’s beautiful. And I love when brands have that personal touch. Also, it makes your agency name unique. SEO or “marketing agency” is so overused.

JS: Like a dentist near me?

SD: That’s actually their name. “Dentist Near Me.” Genius, right?

JS: That’s brilliant.

Website Care Plan and Design

SD: On your site, you mention a “website care plan.” What’s that?

JS: It’s a holdover from my digital marketing days. I host the site, make all updates, add pages or functionality—whatever they need. I’m fast, so it’s more efficient. Some agencies will say “3 hours a month,” but I just say, if you need something, I’ll do it. If something’s time-consuming, I’ll let them know. Maybe find a plug-in or API to do it instead.

SD: That makes sense. I’ve seen that work before, just not phrased that way. And it helps prevent bigger overhauls down the line.

JS: Yes, it’s also better for developers. Taking over someone else’s site is tough—figuring out the theme, plug-ins. If I built it and still manage it, there’s no reason to go elsewhere.

SD: That’s helpful for both sides. Like with designers, switching mid-project means starting from scratch.

JS: Exactly.

Website Tweaking Woes

SD: We update our website obsessively. Like every week, it’s a new template.

JS: I never touch mine. I hate it.

SD: Most developers I know say that! I just give feedback like, “I didn’t like that phrasing.”

JS: That’s fair.

Mini Game: Absurd Questions

SD: Okay. Mini game time. Absurd question: how many eggs could you eat in a day?

JS: If I was incentivized? Maybe ten.

SD: Only ten?

JS: I have to be careful with food now.

SD: Someone on the podcast once said fifty. The question started from a story—guy had to eat his age in eggs after losing fantasy football.

JS: Twenty-five eggs? That’s rough.

Outreach: LinkedIn vs. Email

SD: Outreach: LinkedIn or email?

JS: I use LinkedIn. But it depends—your market, messaging, network. Cold messaging is hard. LinkedIn allows people to ignore me gracefully. Cold emails can trigger people. I don’t do email but know it works.

SD: I’ve found combining both works well. Email, then connect on LinkedIn so they see a face. But people on LinkedIn often spam. The more messages, the less likely I respond.

JS: Yeah, if you message me three or four times—“Thoughts?”—my thought is block.

SD: Exactly. But cold emails can be bad too if unprimed. It’s about doing it right.

JS: Yeah. Some people go by the numbers—send 10,000 and hope 1% convert. But if 93% hate what I said, that’s not good to me.

SD: I get that. My first newsletter got zero replies. My boss said, “I didn’t think it would work.” After I sent it!

JS: Gotta let people fail.

Deserted Island: Alone or With Someone You Hate?

SD: Would you rather be alone or stuck with someone you hate on a deserted island?

JS: Someone I hate. That’ll change quickly. Loneliness kills hope. And eventually, you’ll talk. Or, you know, you can kill them.

SD: I wasn’t going there—but you’re not wrong. Gives you something to do.

JS: That’d make a good short film.

SD: I can’t stay quiet around strangers, so I’d talk eventually. Or kill Frank.

JS: Who’s Frank?

SD: No one. Sorry to the Franks of the world.

JS: I’d want the sharks with lasers, like Dr. Evil.

Final Question: Bad Press or No Press?

SD: Bad press or no press—what’s worse?

JS: I think no press. Brene Brown said, “You can either piss some people off or not matter.” If everyone likes you, you’re white noise.

SD: Depends on the bad press. Murder on a desert island? That’s fine. But kicking babies? Not so good.

JS: Spartans threw babies off cliffs. History is fun.

SD: True. Bad press can be spun. At least people know you. Even if they hate you, that’s awareness.

JS: Or you attract clients who like your bad behavior—and start your evil empire.

SD: Everyone needs one. Not really. Don’t quote me.

JS: Just want sharks with lasers.

Wrap-Up

SD: That’s all the time we have. We really accomplished something today.

JS: We did. Important things. Fun things. Clickable things.

SD: Laugh and learn—two Ls. Or is it live, laugh, learn? Kill Frank?

JS: I just bought the domain.

SD: Perfect. Collaborate on killfrank.com. Thank you so much for being an amazing guest.

JS: No, thank you.

SD: Thanks to everyone watching or listening. Don’t forget to like and subscribe. And hopefully no Franks die in the near future. Have a lovely day. Bye.

https://www.linkedin.com/company/therootofpi

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